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vaillant ecomax 824e flashing e20,e13,f20. How to fix it?

Thing is, that my boiler (which is vaillant ecomax824e) use to go through these codes e20 and then f 20, or e13 and then f20. And if you resset, it was working as nothting happened. During last 6 month’s I noticed that :
• when I run the bath, I have to turn tap down low to get water hot, if I run tap at a higher flow it only gets luke warm. Same thing use to be before.
• while showering the water changes from hot to cold, when it suppose to be hot. And if you open hot water tap again, you‘ll get hot water,but after minute it comes cold again.
Lately this ‘water changing time‘ became shorter. And one day hot water disapeared at all, flashing on display screen e20 and was a little bit smelly like burned wire(but i wasn‘t sure of this smell, so haven‘t paid a lot of attention to this).After few ressets, it starts flashing e13 with some “bang bang“ in the boiler (when boiler starts to heat up water or if on central heating mode), than turns to f20. After night left swichted off and after some attempts to resset during next day , heating works fine and water we get, when heating on. One or two days passes like this, and we get hot water, from hot water mode. But same thing – at the begining hot, which in 30 seconds becomes cold. And two days hot water disapaered again. No, when I doing same thing with resseting, there is no hot water or heating also not comes on. Screen flashing e13 or f20, depends from temperature boiler reaches.When temperature 98 c it turns, on f20 mode.
Pressure in the boiler 1-1.5 bar, when temperature rises up to98 c and pressure comes out from right diapazone it turns, on f20 mode, and pressure comes back to right diapazone1-1.5 bar. On display everything works as normal. Boiler starts heating up (water or CH) it goes that selfchecking stages from 0 to 7 and then stops ,because starts e13 or f20 flashing. It selfchecking stages goes like that,when water tab open 0,1,2 then 6, when you close tab 7.And one more thing, when boiler starts work you can hear all these normal noises(when it‘s in normal work regime), except no “grr grr“ noise.
So after a lot of reading and comparing others problems with mine, I assume, it could be:
1. a diverter valve diaphram (or all diverter valve ),
2. also service kit in for the diverter valve
3. heat exchanger has blocked
4. pump(water pump, I suppose,which Carefree suggested, what‘s also makes sense now).
QUESTIONS :
• are my suspicions right?
• how to check is pump, diverter valve or heat exchanger working fine or it‘s time to change it?
• What are parts codes for diverter valve diaphram, diverter valve, diverter valve service kit, heat exchanger, pump(water pump). Should these parts be originals to vaillant ecomax824e, or only vaillant make parts, or from others producers parts also fits.
• Maybe ‘key‘ button could help the fault, but when I press and hold it for 15 seconds nothing hapens.What then is correct use of this button?

THANK‘S FOR YOUR PATIENCE

Jane
September 2010

Vaillant Heating, Home Heating Systems Flashing Thing Boiler

Pump is sorted by now. I have back hot water and central heating. But some problems with hot water persists.
When turn the hot-tap on I can feel the hot water coming out, but soon it becomes only warm,when suppose to be hot (because only hot water tap is open and opened to the end). It does that,when the flow is good. When i run tap down low, then I get “proper“hot water. And another thing: I waited untill radiators cool down, then put on my boiler only hot water mode and turned on hot water tap for about 10 minutes – radiators were hot (as you set on max heating). At the begining I presumed, that diverter not doing it‘s job. So i was observing diverter, when you turn the hot water on you can see the spindle pushing up to the midle and when there is demand for heating you can see the spindle pulling down and stays there. So now, I assume that DHW heat exchanger is blocked, as carefree mentioned such posibility. QUESTION is:
• how do i clean it?
• do i need take apart this dhw heat exchanger? Take filter or something out? Or just soak whole exchanger in something?
• With what I can give good and quick cleaning? Is citric acid ok? Or maybe hydrochloric acid, phosphoric acid or sulphamic acid? Do i need to dilute acid or should use undiluted? If dilute - how much and how long to soak or clean before rinsing? If undiluted - how long to soak or clean before rinsing?
• And with what to clean black bits, if i find any there?
My boiler is vaillant ecomax824e and DHW heat exchanger Vaillant part no: 065053.
THANK YOU

Jane
September 2010

And one more question. Maybe then you could separate pump‘s electric motor(that circle metal part with big screw at the front) from rest of mechanical pump body(where water inlet and outlet are). And then replace it with existing vaillant mechanical pump body(where water inlet and outlet are). So in this way, i could sort problem, where to afix an automatic air release and diferent diameter "water inlet and oulet" hole problem, in one go. Please tell me is this possible way of doing?

Jane
September 2010

Thank you for answer. Now I have some questions about pump. You advised, to replace existing pump with 15-50 Grundfos head for my boiler ecomax824e. So, i had a good look at existing vaillant pump and compared with others domestic water pumps, which suits for central heating systems(including the one you offered) and I found some diferrences between them. So I have some questions there:
1. Domestic water pumps don‘t have where to afix an automatic air release, which is provided and fixed on existing pump. So how and where then you need to afix the automatic air release? Or maybe with these domestic pumps you don‘t need one? But how then you release air?
2. The hole of the head you advised (also the holes of the other heads wich screwfix sales) are much bigger than original pump? Original pump is vaillant 161106. So how do you sort that issue, if you replacing not with original part, but with other make domestic water pump, which has bigger head hole? Do you need to atach new, bigger pump valves? Or it‘s the only possible pump replacement with original part?
THANK‘S FOR YOUR HELP

Jane
September 2010

All points to a sticking pump (remove the screw on the front to visually see if it's running).

The divertor is a Honeywell, but why are you looking at that?
It seems you're overcomplicating the issue.

The key button is useless to you unless you know what to do.

Carefree
September 2010

Thank you for answer.As you said, I turned off the warmstart and run the central heating, but it‘s not working. When boiler turns itself on, starts going throught selfchecking stages and then stops,because starts e13 or f20 flashing(depends on what temperature is reached). It selfchecking stages goes like that, 0,1,2,3,4 and switch to error.And one more thing, when I checked this for few times and left boiler in that mode for some time, it started showing not f20 or just f.Then I try to swich off CH, but it not reacted at all. Then I swiched off the boiler and swiched back on again. There were no lights on display at all. Then I swiched off the boiler , also swiched off the boiler from the mains and after 10 minutes swiched back on again everything and done resset. Then boiler came alive and let me swich off CH. Does this indicates anything particular?
How to indicate visually, when opening boiler‘s cabinet:
• is pump working fine,
• is diverter valve working fine
• heat exchanger working fine
• what‘s indicates that something wrong?
Also, I would like to ask:
1. what for diagnostic mode is used, if display already indicates fault?
2. maybe then, diagnostic mode and that “key“ button, could help to indicate where problem is for sure?
3. also, can you change only diaphram for diverter valve in this model(vaillant ECOMAX 824E) or you need change, whole diverter valve?
4. what is diaphram‘s for diverter valve code for this model, or it‘s just vaillant diverter valve diaphram?

Jane
September 2010

Please disregard (for now) my previous comment I now realise you have the 'early' Ecomax (bevelled front)
not the more recent and common one. I have no answers for e20 (as I have no information for it).
F20 still stands as boiler overheat, boiler shut down by overheat thermostat.
E13 Refers to a water deficiency error, maximum permissable temperature of NTC1 has been exceeded. Appliance blocked.

If these faults occur in both C/H and H/W modes, then the previous comment about the pump holds up, and a
standard 15-50 Grundfos head change will sort it.
However (I'll make an assumption here), your water is set to warmstart (pre-heat the water heat exchanger).
this is indicated by a green light bottom left of the display? This is therefore the first function of the boiler
and is probably the cause of the problem.

Please try:

Turn off the warmstart (press the tap symbol until the light to the right of the symbol turns red),
run the central heating, if this works (as I suspect) okay, then the problem is a blocked domestic heat exchanger.
Specialized Vaillant part part no: 065053.
You'd be better off getting a RGI to change parts as it can prove quite awkward
and get a service carried out at the same time.

Carefree
September 2010